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Here’s my belief. I’m Fully aware of the medical diagnosis. How sick chris was; however, I’m a Firm believer that instead of trying to exclude Chris Benoit’s matches and his achievements from any releases. Chris benoit could have been a prime example of the importance of mental health and drug abuse. Yes, Wwe, even back during there wwf days had lot of guys abusing enhancement drugs and drugs like cocaine. Wwe didn’t start to crack down on any of that until after Chris’s death. As a long time wrestling fan sense the age of 7. I forgive the bit Chris benwatt but never forget what he did but I also choose to remember him for the tremendous athlete he was in the ring, for being one of the greatest technical wrestlers. I chose to remember him just like Dean malinko said for who he was before that incident, not for it,not after but who he was before. I choose to remember him for that. Rather anybody thinks wrestling is fake or not. If forget these are real human beings putting their bodies on the WA’ pushing themselves beyond their limit to not only fight in the ring but to perform and entertain us. To be the superstars, Athletes they are.
I know there are Benoit fan boys that cannot get past the fact that he murdered his son and wife. They want to blame his brain, the same brain that allowed him to have great matches. If you want some perspective on how mainstream fans think about Benoit, check out the comments of this article on Deadspin. Most people do not want to watch him and most believe WWE should completely disassociate themselves with him. Here’s a link, but Daniel if you have a problem, feel free to take it down. http://deadspin.com/dead-wrestler-of-the-week-chris-benoit-1468485429
Wrong! That’s not a mainstream person’s opinion. This guy writes a wrestling column and is the typical “fan boy.” And, let’s not get into the fact that the guy isn’t a very good writer and loves nothing more than to make himself look like a genius of the wrestling industry, not to mention the English language frequently using language way above the general internet reader.
I’m not talking about the writer, I’m talking about the comments. You can try to deny and talk yourself out of Benoit’s actions, but you cannot deny a large portion of the audience wants nothing to do with owning any more Benoit material. Why make them uncomfortable or turn them off from purchasing a DVD. Any person saying they’re not buying a DVD (Shawn Michaels’ in particular) is lying. If you really want see Benoit, you likely already own a DVD or can go to YouTube.
I’m asking for one legit reason for it makes any sense on WWE’s part to engage in controversy, by putting Benoit in a DVD. One reason.
As far as the people allegedly uncomfortable, I firmly believe that a great deal of them are making these claims solely to support the WWE who have chosen, on their own, to delete Benoit in spite of the chairman’s statement that he would be included in historical accounts/complete presentations. If WWE starts including him, it won’t negatively impact their bottom line.
REASON #1
Why should we care about one segment of the audience (those supporting Benoit’s removal), at the expense of those wanting Benoit content to stay in? We all have fast forward buttons to use if we don’t want to see Benoit. Unfortunately, when he’s not included, you remove choice.
REASON #2:
As the legit/mainstream link I provided explains, so that you don’t ruin presentations and storylines.
REASON #3:
So that Benoit’s surviving children make some residuals. They lost their father because of the damage inflicted to his brain after years of wrestling — while also being taken away from them through their youth.
REASON #4:
Using Benoit could also be a good way to help raise awareness on the concussion issue. WWE has already come out in support of the Sports Legacy Institute who originally diagnosed the concussions. They could include a message on the screen at the conclusion of the TV or DVD presentation with SLI’s web address where people could make donations. Surely that helps a lot more than cutting Benoit out.
I can tell you that I’m one of those offended. I was watching Survivor Series 2005 and couldn’t continue to watch Booker T vs Chris Benoit. How is that hard to imagine people not wanting to glamorize a murder. I think including him will not only hurt their bottom line, but bring unwanted criticism from wrestling and mainstream media. BTW, the link you provided is just finding some website opinion piece to support your argument. I’m looking at a larger scope from Deadspin. WWE hasn’t been hurt or lost a dime by not including Benoit, so other than appeasing diehard Benoit fans or lets say “5% of the hardcore audience, they’ll either won’t buy because they’ll download or will buy regardless, it doesn’t hurt them leave Benoit in the past. It’s just not worth for them to do.
If watching Benoit vs. Booker bothered you, sorry. But, you could have fast-forwarded or used the match as a bathroom break. When they take him out, NOBODY has an option. How is that better? It really isn’t and there’s no way anyone can tell me that having a choice is worse than not having one.
Keep in mind that the comment section you’re asking me to look at is full of wrestling fans — something I thought would contradict your point of Deadspin being mainstream. The story I’m linking to is written by someone outside of wrestling circles looking at things from the perspective of what wrestling really is — entertainment. If you take 4 minutes out of your favorite show, you ruin the story.
Furthermore, if including Benoit would hurt the bottom line, where’s the evidence to support that? If you look at the evidence (releases since 2007 where a Benoit match is included), I think you might actually be able to make the argument that Benoit doesn’t hurt sales and *may* actually help it. Granted, those releases (like War Games) had popular themes, but still.
Taking him out serves no purpose when considering that those who can’t stand him would still have the option of not watching those minutes. I can hope you can at least see how unfair that would be for the rest of us who want him included.
AJ, nobody cares if you were ‘offended’. You come across as a whiny brat who wants to have it your way, no matter what everyone else things. You state that mainstream fans don’t want to see Benoit. Wrong. I want to see Benoit. Who are YOU to take that away from ME? Use your fast forward button, and shut up.
Thanks a lot Danny B! I’ve been sick so I’m just now seeing this article. I really appreciate everything you and the rest of your staff do. Keep up the good work guys.
When they put the boston marathon bomber on Rolling Stone there was heat , when OJ wrote a book called , “If I Did It” there was heat , gee , I can’t imagine WWE not putting a murder / suicide person on all future WWE releases.
OJ’s book upset people because it was seen as though he was rubbing it in people’s faces that he got away with the crime (which is the biggest problem so many people have with those murders). Notice how nobody has a problem that he’s still included in the Naked Gun movies.
The Boston Marathon bomber had no business on the cover of a music magazine. It had nothing to do with the subject of the magazine and they only put him there for attention. Guess what? It worked.
Benoit belongs on Michaels WrestleMania set for the exact reason that the Boston Marathon bomber doesn’t belong on the Rolling Stone cover — relevancy. Benoit was in a match against Michaels at WrestleMania and the compilation was originally promoted as having all of Michaels’ WrestleMania matches. Now it has all but one and effectively is an incomplete presentation all because WWE, for their own reasons, doesn’t want to include the match.
Next they’re gonna only include highlights of Bret/Shawn, right? He’s in War Games ffs. Just cut the footage after HHH taps. That’s what they did to Lesnar/Taker Unforgiven 2002 for some stupid reason.
Since i read up on the FACTS about the Benoit incident. i lean towards Chris Nowinksi and his institute and what they found out about un protected chair shots to the head and how it damaged Benoits brain beyond repair. The whole Benoit incident was a unfortunate thing and Benoit shouldn’t be taken off sets because of this. Im not saying he should have new sets come out centering around his career but christ WWE put a rapist in the HOF.
That’s ridiculous. The reason for killing someone matters. If it didn’t, then how many soldiers would be considered murderers today? Instead they’re considered heroes.
With that said, I’m glad you types finally acknowledge the facts concerning these murders — facts that even WWE now supports as evidenced by their newfound working relationship with the Sports Legacy Institute that uncovered the Benoit facts in the first place.
The bottom line that we all agree on now is that Benoit was sick. If he wasn’t he wouldn’t have committed those murders. Should he ever be celebrated as a great wrestler? No. Should he be included in complete show presentations? Yes, if only so as not to ruins the history and overall storylines.
It’s difficult to dismiss Benoit as a excellent (dare I say one of the best) in-ring performers. But it is just as difficult to dismiss his awful actions as a human. Ultimately, the wrestler and the person are one in the same. Story lines are the least of concerns here, I think. The position WWE should take as far as his professional contributions to the business & their acknowledgement of them will forever be HEAVILY debated. I say whatever route they go, be consistant: either include him on releases or don’t, but don’t pull this half-ass editing crap like it makes a difference to the viewer. We know he’s a killer, whether he is on the video for 2 seconds or 2 hours. And if you are gonna feature him, don’t flip-flop (“Yes, put him on ‘$ in the Bank’ Anthology but don’t put him on “Mr. Wrestlemania’ “). That said, let’s get started on the Norman Smiley DVD!
You’re absolutely right. If they’re truly the professional, world-class company they like to say they are, they have to take a consistent approach. Anything else, including this flip-flopping with the Michaels WrestleMania compilation, comes across as amateurish at best.
They should stick to McMahon’s own statements on the subject:
“Vince McMahon Comments On Including Chris Benoit In New WWE History Magazine
Posted by Ashish on 09.10.2009
Says we can’t pretend Benoit didn’t exist…
In the new special edition WWE magazine titled “The Untold History of The WWE,” Vince McMahon comments on every era of WWE. When asked about Chris Benoit and whether there will ever be a time when WWE can acknowledge his part in WWE history, McMahon said the following.
“It’s not right to pretend he didn’t exist. It’s one thing to include him as part of a historical perspective, which I believe is OK, and it’s another thing to promote him, which is not OK. The situation is very similar to that of O.J. Simpson – despite his controversy, O.J. was still a part of the NFL scene. You can’t deny that he existed.”
In other words, if it’s a complete presentation on DVD/Blu-Ray/Classics on Demand/potential new network, Benoit has to be included. On the other hand, nobody should ever expect a Benoit match to appear on a Randy Orton DVD unless the theme of that DVD is to showcase ALL of Orton’s World title victories. Because the theme of this Michaels set was to have been to show all of his WrestleMania matches, the Benoit match should have been included. By taking him out of the Michaels set, they are going against McMahon’s own statements.
Another interesting thing I read a few months ago, from Benoit’s sister in-law, that had Benoit not did what he did, he still wouldn’t be alive today. According to doctor’s, they said that he would have lived up to the end of April 2008, because of the way his brain was, and his heart was also aged rapidly to around the heart of a very sick 80 year old man.
have any of you half wits ever bothered to READ the facts the PROVEN medical records?not just ride on your high horses and judge things and people and events that you have no idea about.Benoit was a very very sick man his brain was mush this was PROVEN by medical science,the doctors aid he had the brain of a 80 year old with advanced alzeheimers syndrome.So why don’t you self righteous dicks actually read up on the FACTS instead of taking the idiots in the medias side of things
Since you mentioned the biased media, let’s also get that topic out of the way. The media couldn’t care less about Benoit, or how WWE chooses to use Benoit footage. The idea that the media would be all over them if they had a Benoit match on a DVD is ridiculous. Why would they?
And, there have been plenty of athletes who’ve had also had checkered backgrounds — three of which are in the WWE’s Hall of Fame (Verne Gagne, Jimmy Snuka and convicted rapist Mike Tysen). Did anybody in the media paint WWE in a bad light as a result of the association? No. Do they still appear on DVDs? Yes.
Ray Lewis is another very modern example of someone with a similar checkered past. He was not only allowed to continue as a star in the NFL, but he also secured endorsement deals and magazine covers.
It’s not like there isn’t already a sensible precedent both by WWE and also by how other athletes have been treated. Now is the time to relax the ban on Benoit.
And, before anybody says Benoit has no business in the Hall of Fame, understand that I’m not saying he does. If I had any say, he wouldn’t be in the Hall of Fame. However, he should be included in every complete show presentation whether it’s on DVD or TV.
Yeah we keep hearing this, but could an 80 year old with a disease create and map out complicated matches, including the 2 out of the 3 falls match just a month earlier on PPV…I tend not to think so. Also, people with Alzheimer’s killing their family.
First, most of the greats, including Benoit, have the ability and typically prefer to call most of the match on the fly with only a few spots pre-arranged.
Second, it’s not as hard as you’d think to have a “mapped out” match. They generally work with the same guys so many times that by the time they’re put in the ring for a PPV, they’ve rehearsed so many of the same spots many, many times that all they really have to remember are the few fresh spots.
Finally, Benoit wasn’t actually 80. He had a head injury that clouded his judgment in much the same way an 80 year old Alzheimer’s patient has clouded judgment. It doesn’t mean he couldn’t function; it just meant he prone to having intermittent episodes.
Since they’re not having the WM20 match, they should have another match from anywhere just so we get 17 matches at the least. There’s tons of great non-WM HBK matches.
So, does the WWE delete all matches and segments involving Jimmy Snuka, too?
Chris Benoit was ill, a result from his wrestling style. Someone, who risked his life for entertainment reasons, is treated liked garbage. I would call the murder-suicide an accident. I doubt he knew what he did. Owen Hart’s death was an accident, too. But here the WWE would be happy to include Owen Hart matches in the DVD- and Blu-ray-releases. Hypocrites!
LOL. An accident. It reminds me of the old George Carlin joke about the guy who killed everyone in his family, his pets, his friends and his neighbors. When asked what happened he said he was just cleaning his gun when it suddenly went off.
Accidedent. SMH. The Benoit trolls are out in full force in this thread.
It’s sickening to see someone compare Owen’s death to Benoit’s. Owen did not kill his family and himself. Benoit did. Owen’s death was not suicidal. It was a tragic accident due to a stunt gone wrong. Benoit’s was a murder-suicide as he murdered his family and then committed suicide himself. No accident there.
Accident? Matter of opinion, I guess. But it shouldn’t have happened. Something about the death of a woman and child at the hands of a man being an “accident” just doesn’t seem to fly.
The Benoit apologists will use the “brain of an 80 year old man with alzheimers” as their justification why he did what he did. I’m sorry, but I don’t seem to recall reading many stories about 80 year old men with alzheimers killing innocent women and children, let alone their own wife and child. In order to kill a human being it has to be something that is already inside of you.
The whole 80 year old brain with alzheimers thing has always been questionable to me because how can an 80 year old man with alzheimers remember things like going to an airport, getting on the right plane, bringing his boarding his pass, finding the right hotel, getting to the arena, remembering his lines for his promos, remembering spots to do in a match, remembering the finish of the match and then leaving the building, and lather rinse repeat the next day and day-in and day-out, week after week, month after month, year after year. He certainly had no problem remembering to text his friends to tell them that he wouldn’t be showing up at the Vengeance PPV. He also had no problem remembering his home address when he texted that out to WWE and saying that the driveway gate was open and the dogs were in the yard. Sounds like he knew exactly what he was doing and saying. But the Benoit apologists will cling to anything they can that will somehow justify his actions because they can’t listen to the truth and don’t wanna believe that their hero would do something like that.
I have no doubt that the damage done to his brain after all the years in the ring was serious. No doubt at all. But to use that as an excuse is foolish thinking. Just like blaming steroids is foolish as well. The guy had serious problems beyond just brain damage and roid rage.
Verne threw a 97 year old man on the floor. The guy was taken to the hospital and released a few days later. Unfortunately due to his age he was in such bad shape that he eventually passed away. Not even remotely close to the same thing as strangling two people and watching them die right in front of you.
Since you types seem to be so obsessed with how the media would blast WWE for using Benoit footage, how do you explain their ongoing usage of Jimmy Snuka? He’s been accused of murder and the investigation would very recently reopened.
“Accused” of murder. A big difference than actually being proven that you committed murder and suicide. There was never any trial because there wasn’t enough evidence against him. So why should WWE take any action against the guy when according to the government he did nothing wrong?
The only people that really know what happened that day are Snuka and his girlfriend. And unless someone can find hard evidence that proves he did something wrong than he’s an innocent man.
Well medical science has already proven that Benoit was in an incapacitated state, meaning he wasn’t of sound mind, yet that’s not good enough for you. And, WWE is now supporting the Sports Legacy Institute in every way possible which lends even greater support to the idea that even they acknowledge Benoit wasn’t acting the way he would normally act if he wasn’t ill. As a result, it stands to reason that since they’ve finally acknowledge it, Benoit should make a return to DVDs and complete show presentations.
With regards to Snuka, they’ve recently reopened the case so they must have some evidence against him. They’re not going to just open the case because someone asked them to. Whether or not it’s enough to convict him 30 years later when no doubt much of the time-sensitive evidence is gone is anybody’s guess.
Given the precedent set with the Benoit case, do you feel that Snuka should also be removed if he’s found in any way guilty? If your answer is no, you’ve just proven yourself to be a hypocrite. If your answer is yes, you’ve just proven why Benoit should return to complete show presentations on DVD or TV.
If by some chance they are able to prove that Snuka killed his girlfriend then yes WWE should give him the same treatment that they give Benoit. He should be included in complete Anthologies and full shows-only. I’ve never said Benoit should be removed from anthologies or full shows at all. So I’m not sure what your point was. This Shawn Michaels DVD, regardless of what the format is, is neither a complete anthology nor a full show.
I’m fully aware of the SLI and the work they’ve done. I think it’s great that WWE is finally on board with them. I remember in 2007 when WWE wanted nothing to do with them and they came across very badly by acting that way. With all that said, just because Benoit was proven to have brain damage and “wasn’t in sound mind” when he committed 3 murders, that doesn’t excuse him. There’s plenty of people that have had brain damage and have done bad things while not of sound mind and not every one of them ended with triple murder. And not just triple murder, but triple murder over a 3 day period. This wasn’t just a momentary “snap” where he lost his mind and went on a killing spree. He killed Nancy on a Friday night. Then he killed Daniel on a Saturday. Then late Saturday night he texted his friends(William Regal being one of them) and WWE and told them that he won’t be able to fly to the PPV because of a family emergency. Then he killed himself Sunday morning. So he “wasn’t in sound mind”, yet he still had enough sense to contact work and tell them that he wasn’t going to be able to make it? Ok then. Then once he realized he was going to be heading to jail for life for what he did, he decided to kill himself on Sunday morning. Not of sound mind is only an excuse when you lose it temporarily. Not 3 days straight. I’m sorry.
First off, when this project was initially announced the promotional material stated all of Michaels’ 17 matches would be included. Therefore, the Benoit match should be included.
Second, Benoit is NOT a triple murderer. You cannot murder yourself, even if you nonsensical “logic” might appear to imply otherwise.
Third, your momentary snap analogy is inconsequential considering Benoit’s overall brain damage. With that condition you can go in an out of normalcy.
Fourth, if you don’t buy the medical science proving you can go in and out of normalcy when you are in Benoit-like condition, what if he wasn’t of sound mind and snapped when he killed the first two people? We’ve already established that he wasn’t. The texts and the fact that he killed himself doesn’t even come into play here as frequently idiots who commit suicide (which is what it’s called when you kill yourself, not murder) are considered misunderstood heroes.
I personally believe the Benoit match SHOULD be included in the set, but such is the way of the world on this site these that I feel like I will just get flamed by these moral do-gooders if I dare to list my reasons why. It’s a shame. God forbid anybody presents the other side of the argument.
This is no different then a greatest hits release , like Kiss or Aerosmith would release. It’s good to have something out there for newer fans who only know DX or HBK as the guy who was a ref a few times. What made him the icon? What made him Mr. Wrestlemania? This is good for people who aren’t going to buy 16 different releases to get these matches … Lets be honest , some of these show stunk except for the HBK match!
Personally i find this Benoit thing a bit dragged out even to this day, No one really knows what happend on that day they were not there so they did not see if from there own eyes, it was all media and you should never listen to what media says cause its all bullshit, WWE werent there when it happend with whatever Benoit did, so they are just taking Media side, Who knows but we will never truly know what happend to Benoit and what he did on that day in 07, It is up to WWE to include his matches or not because at the end of the day they can do whatever they want but it is ridiculous to not include complete matches on sets like this even involving Benoit, Whats the worse they could have happened, if they couldnt bother editing the commentary with any praise to Benoit they could have just not included no commentary and just see it from the arena point of view or they could have edited out Benoit entrance and left at it as it is, Well at least people who have been collecting dvd of the years can watch shows with benoit complete and unedited and it is going to stay like that forever cause wwe dont want to include any matches of his unless they really really need to!!
I hate the “no one was there , so no one knows” defense … gimmie a break we like wrestling but these are just people. Why should they get a pass for everything they say or do? If my car has your paint on it and you car is dented and you walk outside and see this and call a cop , when I walk out of Wal-mart can I say , “no one was out here , so know one knows.” ? Would you shake my hand and I would be free to go or would the outstanding evidence make you want to file a report and get my insurance number?
This is a pass. Seems like wwe is trying to milk more money out of fans.. this is a lame release. Hbk unreleased would make 30 times more sense.. and I’m not a mark or nothing and I understand its his performances that got him the name Mr. Wrestlemania, but Shawn has a terrible wm record he lost so much.
your heading is incorrect. wwe clarifies ”exclusion” of chris benoit match, ‘not’ inclusion. wwe is full of a bunch of ball-less corporate douchebags!!!
You may be right about the title. My thinking with that wording was that their synopsis for the DVD inferred the WM20 match is included (“all 17 matches”), therefore Benoit included, but that we now have clarity on the inclusion, or lack thereof as it turns out. I attempted to word it like an update to our last article on it. Also, not give it away unless you read the article. 🙂
Exactly! But, no doubt, the very poorly selling Hart unreleased compilation has put the unreleased sets at least temporarily on the shelf. But they should have expected that when you consider they didn’t even have enough master quality material that they had to go ripping stuff off of YouTube (like the Andre match) and off multi-generational VHS (like the Georgia match). Considering that Hart and Michaels had similar careers prior to Michaels’ most recent run (2002-2009) no doubt made the company fearful of releasing an unreleased set on Michaels.
They have to be smart with their next UNRELEASED set and release it on guys who were at the forefront when wrestling was extremely popular in the 80s or 90s and where they can pull entertaining and competitive matches from free TV shows. Guys like Flair and Austin should be the next to get the UNRELEASED compilation set.
I. Love. Benoit. Great wrestler, awesome role model. Shame that there aren’t more upstanding human beings like him, not just in wrestling, but on the planet.
I wasn’t going to buy this anyway, but you have to look at this, what if more wrestlers started killing their families and killing themselves, that’s really going to butcher the footage that they own. Hopfully that never happens. WWE needs to release better DVD’s like the ones mentioned in the surveys.
Because we’re all wrestling fans, we have our biases. Some of us want to look smart, so to do so they side with the company because God only knows they can’t make a mistake. Others lack the maturity and life experiences (like a death of someone actually important in our lives) and took the Benoit murders a little too personally. Some never cared for Benoit. Others, like myself, hate that shows and storylines get ruined by his deletion.
It’s a good read and I think a lot of people might be surprised to see how those who don’t live within the “WWE Universe” view the company’s current stance on Benoit.
Did you unironically call people who don’t buy every DVD WWE releases, “sheep”? Damn those younger fans who weren’t around for Shawn’s heyday! What a buncha marks for buying a DVD that’s readily available in Walmart instead of tediously tracking everything down online! I love this site, but I wish you guys would hear yourselves sometimes.
Yeah, because buying an expensive new release is so much smarter in light of the fact that most of the older releases that are easy to track down on Amazon are cheap. Amazon is so much more tedious than Walmart.
SRB,
You know that unreleased stale commentary you speak of really makes it a must buy regardless of the fact that it’s already been released 28 times.
I’ll be sure to do that douche bag. It will probably arrive around the same time you get the balls to find me and call me an idiot to my face. Ask your moms permission though first you tool.
I have no interest in watching anything Benoit to the point of I destroyed and threw out the hard knocks DVD i owned so it was one less copy in existence!!! for what he did his legacy deserves to be discarded and never glorified.
I believe that there’s a difference between showing a match where he wins (such as WrestleMania XX vs. Triple H & Shawn Michaels for the World Heavyweight Championship) & where he loses (i.e. Fall Brawl 1996: War Games Match between nWo & 4 Horsemen; WrestleMania 21: Money In The Bank Ladder Match vs. Edge, Christian, Chris Jericho, Kane, Shelton Benjamin; New Year’s Revolution 2005: Elimiantion Chamber Match for the World Heavyweight Championship with HBK as the Special Guest Referee vs. HHH, Edge, Jericho, Batista, Randy Orton). Besides, it’s on 3 DVDs [WrestleMania XX, Hard Knocks: The Chris Benoit Story & The Greatest Superstars Of WrestleMania]
It’s wrestling. Who cares who wins? Some of the all-time greats have very average win-loss records.
The fact is that WWE chose to put together this compilation of retreads. They should have stuck to the theme they chose to present. They apparently didn’t. Any way you look at it, this is a massive FAIL.
I was never going to buy this set anyway as I have no need for it as earlier HBK WM matches kinda sucked! 9 & 11 especially & I have actually gotten sick of the Ladder Match from 10!
Obviously WWE are still trying to distance themselves from Benoit as let’s face it, he killed his Wife & Child & instead of facing the charges & the music he killed himself! He did an aweful thing & we seriously need to move on from this!
I do not want to get into a debate saying whether or not the WWE should banish Benoit from all releases or not. My gripe is the WWE shouldn’t put out a Mr. WrestleMania DVD/Blu Ray set if all of the matches aren’t included. I understand that they want to make money but I feel that there are many original sets which have potential to make money: sets on Ted DiBiase, Rick Rude, Daniel Bryan, Junk Yard Dog, Jimmy Hart or Evolution or just be creative like rereleasing all of the Best of the WWF volumes on Blu Ray or more Greatest Rivalries sets with The Rock and Steve Austin or Edge and John Cena or Mick Foley and Undertaker. Don’t get me wrong, Shawn Michaels is a phenomenal athlete. I just don’t feel this set should be titled this way if it isn’t a complete set. By the way…I think this site is fantastic and check it everyday to check up on my DVD news. Keep up the great work!!!
I know there’s some people that say “I can still watch Benoit matches and separate Benoit the wrestler and Benoit the person.” Two things I have to say about that. Number 1, you people are stronger than me. Number 2, there is no separating “the wrestler” and “the person”. Ignorance of the truth does not make it better.
I actually watched the Mania 20 match not too long ago for the first time since the Benoit murders happened. The whole time I was watching the match all I could think about was “As soon as this match ends, Benoit’s wife and little son will be in that same ring celebrating with him. The same wife and son that he strangled and murdered.”
It has nothing to do with “ignorance of the truth.” It has to do with being mature enough to realize that it doesn’t matter. He was an athletic entertainer. Nothing more. Nothing less. Just like his race, creed and orientation doesn’t matter, neither does any other decision he made in his private life. He was a part of history and while he should never be celebrated, he shouldn’t be getting removed from comprehensive projects or complete show presentations.
Yes. It’s nonsense. Trying to have a conversation with someone who doesn’t give themselves a name is nonsense. Anyone on the site can use “anonymous”. How do I know that if I respond to them that it will be the same person responding back to me? There could be 20 people using “anonymous” on this site for all we know. If I’m going to get into a conversation with someone I’d like to know that I’m talking to the same person. What really is nonsense is people who not only hide behind a computer, but also are afraid to even give themselves a label to which other people can identify them.
If whoever responded to my initial comment was really interested in hearing my response then they would have no problem giving themselves a name. It’s not hard. It takes 2 seconds to type it out. And since they haven’t done that they clearly don’t care about anyone else’s opinions except their own. It’s essentially just another form of trolling.
And I’ve said way more than I have to about this subject. I’m done.
I understand that the Benoit tragedy was possibly the lowest point in WWE or Pro-Wrestling history, but if Benoit is not a focal point of the advertising or release in general (which he won’t be, since it’s a specific compilation highlighting HBK) there’s no reason to edit or cut his matches. Releasing “The Streak” while the Undertaker is still competing is ridiculous; putting out Shawn’s ‘complete’ WrestleMania DVD without one of the matches is even dumber. If there is a legal reason to cut Benoit content from DVD’s, fine, but it was years ago, and he’s been on other releases, so I’d prefer WWE stop flop-flopping. He was one of three wrestlers, competing in one out of seventeen matches. I can’t imagine a huge revolt taking place for Benoit’s tiny cameo on the set. No sale for me.
Very well stated and I agree 100% with your thoughts.
This release was already a waste as it featured all previously released material. Removing Benoit essentially ruins the whole concept. It’s no longer a comprehensive look at Michaels’ WrestleMania career.
Benoit put a black eye on WWE and the whole pro wrestling industry, flushing his career down the toilet just by his actions those last three days of his life…why should WWE include any of his matches when they don’t have to?
The Triple Threat was basically focused on Benoit’s journey and it probably would have been difficult to edit out Benoit references…so instead of butchering the whole match, might as well not include it. If people really want it just buy WM20 on Amazon, its like $7 brand new.
Good thing the match won’t make it. The commentary blanks and dubbing the crowd reactions (the NY crowd was 100% behind Benoit and chanting his name throughout the match) will be a heavy duty and take away too much from the match IMO.
Screw them for false advertising. I wouldn’t have bought it anyway because I’d just get the WM XX DVD where the triple threat is unedited but still, the false advertising is what annoys me about this.
This DVD is rather redundant to be honest, but including the Benoit match would only divert attention from the focus of the set and possibly lead to negative publicity.
Some will point at the MITB anthology and cry hypocrisy but the WM 20 match focused so heavily on Benoit and obviously it was his career highlight, so much different example. The best decision is to omit it totally.
Bang on. The set’s about HBK. I’d actually would rather the set be about HBK’s best WM performances (so a few other matches could get scrapped) but considering Shawn was a late addition to the match so to speak, this is the first match that could be scrapped for that reason, let alone the most obvious reason. I have no problem with this at all, and look forward to the set, especially with Shawn’s additional commentary.
I can respect the choice to include Benoit on future releases or not include him. I think that with the sensitivity of the whole benoit murder controversy, it’s probably a safer choice to leave him out. What I don’t like is they include him (MIB anthology), then they don’t (Mr. Wrestlemania). And when they do include him, it’s with an editing job that does absolutely nothing for anything or anyone. Either way WWE goes, I say just be consistent about it. The only message the Benoit DVD situation sends out is that their is no message (not a legitimate one, anyway). The headache continues…
Where exactly does it say “anthology”? It says “Mr. Wrestlemania”. Not “The Shawn Michaels Wrestlemania Anthology”. Reading comprehension, my friend. I’m sure the fact that its NOT called an anthology was a very deliberate decision. You just wrote yourself… “What I don’t like is they include him (MIB anthology), then they don’t (Mr. Wrestlemania).” One is called anthology, one is not. There’s your answer.
Ditto. Not because I have any issue with the decision on Benoit – but because the entire purpose of the set is that it’s a complete anthology. And it isn’t.
This set is really just a milking of a cow that has gone dry. We have all seen these matches. Pack us a fresh anthology: “Mr. Lose My Smile, rather than the title”-that’s one’s at least 6.5 hours.
I’m sure people will hate this, but here is why I think it’s smart on WWE’s part. If you were going to buy this DVD before, you’re probably still going to buy it. Nobody is buying this DVD or any other DVD just for a Benoit match. If you want that match so badly, you’ll spend $6 on Amazon for it. But, there is still a large majority (not the vocal minority online) that want nothing to do with watching a Benoit match. In fact, people may not buy the DVD because it’s there. It’s playing it safe.
The days of thinking that the Internet wrestling fans comprise a small minority are long gone. Everybody has Internet access. Every has Google, YouTube, etc. Everybody can find this or any site. Everybody can use their own brain to come to their own conclusions. We no longer accept everything this or any company says as true or necessarily the correct choice. Those who do are the new age crop of WWE fans who have such loyalty that you’d think the company were a religion. These people are in the ever-shrinking minority.
I’m one who is totally for not including this guy on DVD releases, but I’m kind of mixed on this one.
While I would totally understand them including the Mania XX match, I wonder if maybe they chose to leave this one out because it would require an amount of editing that would take away from the match as a whole.
I’m just trying to find a rational reason why they would include the guy on Anthologies and complete history sets, but leave him out of this one.
I’m not going to debate not including the triple threat, I get why they do it. Maybe when they did the interview Shawn he let it be known he didn’t want the match on there, who knows?
What’s odd is that the description says all 17 but it will really only be 16. Makes me think somebody in the DVD department forgot the rule.
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Here’s my belief. I’m Fully aware of the medical diagnosis. How sick chris was; however, I’m a Firm believer that instead of trying to exclude Chris Benoit’s matches and his achievements from any releases. Chris benoit could have been a prime example of the importance of mental health and drug abuse. Yes, Wwe, even back during there wwf days had lot of guys abusing enhancement drugs and drugs like cocaine. Wwe didn’t start to crack down on any of that until after Chris’s death. As a long time wrestling fan sense the age of 7. I forgive the bit Chris benwatt but never forget what he did but I also choose to remember him for the tremendous athlete he was in the ring, for being one of the greatest technical wrestlers. I chose to remember him just like Dean malinko said for who he was before that incident, not for it,not after but who he was before. I choose to remember him for that. Rather anybody thinks wrestling is fake or not. If forget these are real human beings putting their bodies on the WA’ pushing themselves beyond their limit to not only fight in the ring but to perform and entertain us. To be the superstars, Athletes they are.
we want benoit
cant believe ppl are actually arguing for the inclusion of matches that featured benoit to be of future dvds.
the guy did something horrible, he destroyed his own legacy.
what would WWE do if Hulk Hogan or John Cena decided to go murder there family!?
I know there are Benoit fan boys that cannot get past the fact that he murdered his son and wife. They want to blame his brain, the same brain that allowed him to have great matches. If you want some perspective on how mainstream fans think about Benoit, check out the comments of this article on Deadspin. Most people do not want to watch him and most believe WWE should completely disassociate themselves with him. Here’s a link, but Daniel if you have a problem, feel free to take it down.
http://deadspin.com/dead-wrestler-of-the-week-chris-benoit-1468485429
Wrong! That’s not a mainstream person’s opinion. This guy writes a wrestling column and is the typical “fan boy.” And, let’s not get into the fact that the guy isn’t a very good writer and loves nothing more than to make himself look like a genius of the wrestling industry, not to mention the English language frequently using language way above the general internet reader.
Now, for a real mainstream perspective, check out:
http://socialtimes.com/a-storytelling-lesson-from-world-wrestling-entertainments-darkest-chapter_b130930
I’m not talking about the writer, I’m talking about the comments. You can try to deny and talk yourself out of Benoit’s actions, but you cannot deny a large portion of the audience wants nothing to do with owning any more Benoit material. Why make them uncomfortable or turn them off from purchasing a DVD. Any person saying they’re not buying a DVD (Shawn Michaels’ in particular) is lying. If you really want see Benoit, you likely already own a DVD or can go to YouTube.
I’m asking for one legit reason for it makes any sense on WWE’s part to engage in controversy, by putting Benoit in a DVD. One reason.
As far as the people allegedly uncomfortable, I firmly believe that a great deal of them are making these claims solely to support the WWE who have chosen, on their own, to delete Benoit in spite of the chairman’s statement that he would be included in historical accounts/complete presentations. If WWE starts including him, it won’t negatively impact their bottom line.
REASON #1
Why should we care about one segment of the audience (those supporting Benoit’s removal), at the expense of those wanting Benoit content to stay in? We all have fast forward buttons to use if we don’t want to see Benoit. Unfortunately, when he’s not included, you remove choice.
REASON #2:
As the legit/mainstream link I provided explains, so that you don’t ruin presentations and storylines.
REASON #3:
So that Benoit’s surviving children make some residuals. They lost their father because of the damage inflicted to his brain after years of wrestling — while also being taken away from them through their youth.
REASON #4:
Using Benoit could also be a good way to help raise awareness on the concussion issue. WWE has already come out in support of the Sports Legacy Institute who originally diagnosed the concussions. They could include a message on the screen at the conclusion of the TV or DVD presentation with SLI’s web address where people could make donations. Surely that helps a lot more than cutting Benoit out.
I can tell you that I’m one of those offended. I was watching Survivor Series 2005 and couldn’t continue to watch Booker T vs Chris Benoit. How is that hard to imagine people not wanting to glamorize a murder. I think including him will not only hurt their bottom line, but bring unwanted criticism from wrestling and mainstream media. BTW, the link you provided is just finding some website opinion piece to support your argument. I’m looking at a larger scope from Deadspin. WWE hasn’t been hurt or lost a dime by not including Benoit, so other than appeasing diehard Benoit fans or lets say “5% of the hardcore audience, they’ll either won’t buy because they’ll download or will buy regardless, it doesn’t hurt them leave Benoit in the past. It’s just not worth for them to do.
If watching Benoit vs. Booker bothered you, sorry. But, you could have fast-forwarded or used the match as a bathroom break. When they take him out, NOBODY has an option. How is that better? It really isn’t and there’s no way anyone can tell me that having a choice is worse than not having one.
Keep in mind that the comment section you’re asking me to look at is full of wrestling fans — something I thought would contradict your point of Deadspin being mainstream. The story I’m linking to is written by someone outside of wrestling circles looking at things from the perspective of what wrestling really is — entertainment. If you take 4 minutes out of your favorite show, you ruin the story.
Furthermore, if including Benoit would hurt the bottom line, where’s the evidence to support that? If you look at the evidence (releases since 2007 where a Benoit match is included), I think you might actually be able to make the argument that Benoit doesn’t hurt sales and *may* actually help it. Granted, those releases (like War Games) had popular themes, but still.
Taking him out serves no purpose when considering that those who can’t stand him would still have the option of not watching those minutes. I can hope you can at least see how unfair that would be for the rest of us who want him included.
AJ, nobody cares if you were ‘offended’. You come across as a whiny brat who wants to have it your way, no matter what everyone else things. You state that mainstream fans don’t want to see Benoit. Wrong. I want to see Benoit. Who are YOU to take that away from ME? Use your fast forward button, and shut up.
Thanks a lot Danny B! I’ve been sick so I’m just now seeing this article. I really appreciate everything you and the rest of your staff do. Keep up the good work guys.
You’re welcome.
When they put the boston marathon bomber on Rolling Stone there was heat , when OJ wrote a book called , “If I Did It” there was heat , gee , I can’t imagine WWE not putting a murder / suicide person on all future WWE releases.
They need to put Norman Smiley on the cover of rolling stone magazine. He earned it.
You’re comparing apples to oranges.
OJ’s book upset people because it was seen as though he was rubbing it in people’s faces that he got away with the crime (which is the biggest problem so many people have with those murders). Notice how nobody has a problem that he’s still included in the Naked Gun movies.
The Boston Marathon bomber had no business on the cover of a music magazine. It had nothing to do with the subject of the magazine and they only put him there for attention. Guess what? It worked.
Benoit belongs on Michaels WrestleMania set for the exact reason that the Boston Marathon bomber doesn’t belong on the Rolling Stone cover — relevancy. Benoit was in a match against Michaels at WrestleMania and the compilation was originally promoted as having all of Michaels’ WrestleMania matches. Now it has all but one and effectively is an incomplete presentation all because WWE, for their own reasons, doesn’t want to include the match.
Next they’re gonna only include highlights of Bret/Shawn, right? He’s in War Games ffs. Just cut the footage after HHH taps. That’s what they did to Lesnar/Taker Unforgiven 2002 for some stupid reason.
Since i read up on the FACTS about the Benoit incident. i lean towards Chris Nowinksi and his institute and what they found out about un protected chair shots to the head and how it damaged Benoits brain beyond repair. The whole Benoit incident was a unfortunate thing and Benoit shouldn’t be taken off sets because of this. Im not saying he should have new sets come out centering around his career but christ WWE put a rapist in the HOF.
Amen.
They take him off sets because he murdered his family. *Why* he did it doesn’t matter. Your FACTS do not change this.
That’s ridiculous. The reason for killing someone matters. If it didn’t, then how many soldiers would be considered murderers today? Instead they’re considered heroes.
With that said, I’m glad you types finally acknowledge the facts concerning these murders — facts that even WWE now supports as evidenced by their newfound working relationship with the Sports Legacy Institute that uncovered the Benoit facts in the first place.
The bottom line that we all agree on now is that Benoit was sick. If he wasn’t he wouldn’t have committed those murders. Should he ever be celebrated as a great wrestler? No. Should he be included in complete show presentations? Yes, if only so as not to ruins the history and overall storylines.
Why are you arguing with yourself?
It’s difficult to dismiss Benoit as a excellent (dare I say one of the best) in-ring performers. But it is just as difficult to dismiss his awful actions as a human. Ultimately, the wrestler and the person are one in the same. Story lines are the least of concerns here, I think. The position WWE should take as far as his professional contributions to the business & their acknowledgement of them will forever be HEAVILY debated. I say whatever route they go, be consistant: either include him on releases or don’t, but don’t pull this half-ass editing crap like it makes a difference to the viewer. We know he’s a killer, whether he is on the video for 2 seconds or 2 hours. And if you are gonna feature him, don’t flip-flop (“Yes, put him on ‘$ in the Bank’ Anthology but don’t put him on “Mr. Wrestlemania’ “). That said, let’s get started on the Norman Smiley DVD!
You’re absolutely right. If they’re truly the professional, world-class company they like to say they are, they have to take a consistent approach. Anything else, including this flip-flopping with the Michaels WrestleMania compilation, comes across as amateurish at best.
They should stick to McMahon’s own statements on the subject:
“Vince McMahon Comments On Including Chris Benoit In New WWE History Magazine
Posted by Ashish on 09.10.2009
Says we can’t pretend Benoit didn’t exist…
In the new special edition WWE magazine titled “The Untold History of The WWE,” Vince McMahon comments on every era of WWE. When asked about Chris Benoit and whether there will ever be a time when WWE can acknowledge his part in WWE history, McMahon said the following.
“It’s not right to pretend he didn’t exist. It’s one thing to include him as part of a historical perspective, which I believe is OK, and it’s another thing to promote him, which is not OK. The situation is very similar to that of O.J. Simpson – despite his controversy, O.J. was still a part of the NFL scene. You can’t deny that he existed.”
In other words, if it’s a complete presentation on DVD/Blu-Ray/Classics on Demand/potential new network, Benoit has to be included. On the other hand, nobody should ever expect a Benoit match to appear on a Randy Orton DVD unless the theme of that DVD is to showcase ALL of Orton’s World title victories. Because the theme of this Michaels set was to have been to show all of his WrestleMania matches, the Benoit match should have been included. By taking him out of the Michaels set, they are going against McMahon’s own statements.
Another interesting thing I read a few months ago, from Benoit’s sister in-law, that had Benoit not did what he did, he still wouldn’t be alive today. According to doctor’s, they said that he would have lived up to the end of April 2008, because of the way his brain was, and his heart was also aged rapidly to around the heart of a very sick 80 year old man.
have any of you half wits ever bothered to READ the facts the PROVEN medical records?not just ride on your high horses and judge things and people and events that you have no idea about.Benoit was a very very sick man his brain was mush this was PROVEN by medical science,the doctors aid he had the brain of a 80 year old with advanced alzeheimers syndrome.So why don’t you self righteous dicks actually read up on the FACTS instead of taking the idiots in the medias side of things
Since you mentioned the biased media, let’s also get that topic out of the way. The media couldn’t care less about Benoit, or how WWE chooses to use Benoit footage. The idea that the media would be all over them if they had a Benoit match on a DVD is ridiculous. Why would they?
And, there have been plenty of athletes who’ve had also had checkered backgrounds — three of which are in the WWE’s Hall of Fame (Verne Gagne, Jimmy Snuka and convicted rapist Mike Tysen). Did anybody in the media paint WWE in a bad light as a result of the association? No. Do they still appear on DVDs? Yes.
Ray Lewis is another very modern example of someone with a similar checkered past. He was not only allowed to continue as a star in the NFL, but he also secured endorsement deals and magazine covers.
It’s not like there isn’t already a sensible precedent both by WWE and also by how other athletes have been treated. Now is the time to relax the ban on Benoit.
And, before anybody says Benoit has no business in the Hall of Fame, understand that I’m not saying he does. If I had any say, he wouldn’t be in the Hall of Fame. However, he should be included in every complete show presentation whether it’s on DVD or TV.
Yeah we keep hearing this, but could an 80 year old with a disease create and map out complicated matches, including the 2 out of the 3 falls match just a month earlier on PPV…I tend not to think so. Also, people with Alzheimer’s killing their family.
First, most of the greats, including Benoit, have the ability and typically prefer to call most of the match on the fly with only a few spots pre-arranged.
Second, it’s not as hard as you’d think to have a “mapped out” match. They generally work with the same guys so many times that by the time they’re put in the ring for a PPV, they’ve rehearsed so many of the same spots many, many times that all they really have to remember are the few fresh spots.
Finally, Benoit wasn’t actually 80. He had a head injury that clouded his judgment in much the same way an 80 year old Alzheimer’s patient has clouded judgment. It doesn’t mean he couldn’t function; it just meant he prone to having intermittent episodes.
Since they’re not having the WM20 match, they should have another match from anywhere just so we get 17 matches at the least. There’s tons of great non-WM HBK matches.
if they are not putting all the matches then they should not release this at all! or at least dont associate it with wrestle mania!
So, does the WWE delete all matches and segments involving Jimmy Snuka, too?
Chris Benoit was ill, a result from his wrestling style. Someone, who risked his life for entertainment reasons, is treated liked garbage. I would call the murder-suicide an accident. I doubt he knew what he did. Owen Hart’s death was an accident, too. But here the WWE would be happy to include Owen Hart matches in the DVD- and Blu-ray-releases. Hypocrites!
LOL. An accident. It reminds me of the old George Carlin joke about the guy who killed everyone in his family, his pets, his friends and his neighbors. When asked what happened he said he was just cleaning his gun when it suddenly went off.
Accidedent. SMH. The Benoit trolls are out in full force in this thread.
It’s sickening to see someone compare Owen’s death to Benoit’s. Owen did not kill his family and himself. Benoit did. Owen’s death was not suicidal. It was a tragic accident due to a stunt gone wrong. Benoit’s was a murder-suicide as he murdered his family and then committed suicide himself. No accident there.
Accident? Matter of opinion, I guess. But it shouldn’t have happened. Something about the death of a woman and child at the hands of a man being an “accident” just doesn’t seem to fly.
The Benoit apologists will use the “brain of an 80 year old man with alzheimers” as their justification why he did what he did. I’m sorry, but I don’t seem to recall reading many stories about 80 year old men with alzheimers killing innocent women and children, let alone their own wife and child. In order to kill a human being it has to be something that is already inside of you.
The whole 80 year old brain with alzheimers thing has always been questionable to me because how can an 80 year old man with alzheimers remember things like going to an airport, getting on the right plane, bringing his boarding his pass, finding the right hotel, getting to the arena, remembering his lines for his promos, remembering spots to do in a match, remembering the finish of the match and then leaving the building, and lather rinse repeat the next day and day-in and day-out, week after week, month after month, year after year. He certainly had no problem remembering to text his friends to tell them that he wouldn’t be showing up at the Vengeance PPV. He also had no problem remembering his home address when he texted that out to WWE and saying that the driveway gate was open and the dogs were in the yard. Sounds like he knew exactly what he was doing and saying. But the Benoit apologists will cling to anything they can that will somehow justify his actions because they can’t listen to the truth and don’t wanna believe that their hero would do something like that.
I have no doubt that the damage done to his brain after all the years in the ring was serious. No doubt at all. But to use that as an excuse is foolish thinking. Just like blaming steroids is foolish as well. The guy had serious problems beyond just brain damage and roid rage.
Really? Haven’t heard of an 80-year-old in a similar state murdering someone? Verne Gagne did it sometime after the Benoit incidents.
Verne threw a 97 year old man on the floor. The guy was taken to the hospital and released a few days later. Unfortunately due to his age he was in such bad shape that he eventually passed away. Not even remotely close to the same thing as strangling two people and watching them die right in front of you.
Since you types seem to be so obsessed with how the media would blast WWE for using Benoit footage, how do you explain their ongoing usage of Jimmy Snuka? He’s been accused of murder and the investigation would very recently reopened.
“Accused” of murder. A big difference than actually being proven that you committed murder and suicide. There was never any trial because there wasn’t enough evidence against him. So why should WWE take any action against the guy when according to the government he did nothing wrong?
The only people that really know what happened that day are Snuka and his girlfriend. And unless someone can find hard evidence that proves he did something wrong than he’s an innocent man.
Well medical science has already proven that Benoit was in an incapacitated state, meaning he wasn’t of sound mind, yet that’s not good enough for you. And, WWE is now supporting the Sports Legacy Institute in every way possible which lends even greater support to the idea that even they acknowledge Benoit wasn’t acting the way he would normally act if he wasn’t ill. As a result, it stands to reason that since they’ve finally acknowledge it, Benoit should make a return to DVDs and complete show presentations.
With regards to Snuka, they’ve recently reopened the case so they must have some evidence against him. They’re not going to just open the case because someone asked them to. Whether or not it’s enough to convict him 30 years later when no doubt much of the time-sensitive evidence is gone is anybody’s guess.
Given the precedent set with the Benoit case, do you feel that Snuka should also be removed if he’s found in any way guilty? If your answer is no, you’ve just proven yourself to be a hypocrite. If your answer is yes, you’ve just proven why Benoit should return to complete show presentations on DVD or TV.
If by some chance they are able to prove that Snuka killed his girlfriend then yes WWE should give him the same treatment that they give Benoit. He should be included in complete Anthologies and full shows-only. I’ve never said Benoit should be removed from anthologies or full shows at all. So I’m not sure what your point was. This Shawn Michaels DVD, regardless of what the format is, is neither a complete anthology nor a full show.
I’m fully aware of the SLI and the work they’ve done. I think it’s great that WWE is finally on board with them. I remember in 2007 when WWE wanted nothing to do with them and they came across very badly by acting that way. With all that said, just because Benoit was proven to have brain damage and “wasn’t in sound mind” when he committed 3 murders, that doesn’t excuse him. There’s plenty of people that have had brain damage and have done bad things while not of sound mind and not every one of them ended with triple murder. And not just triple murder, but triple murder over a 3 day period. This wasn’t just a momentary “snap” where he lost his mind and went on a killing spree. He killed Nancy on a Friday night. Then he killed Daniel on a Saturday. Then late Saturday night he texted his friends(William Regal being one of them) and WWE and told them that he won’t be able to fly to the PPV because of a family emergency. Then he killed himself Sunday morning. So he “wasn’t in sound mind”, yet he still had enough sense to contact work and tell them that he wasn’t going to be able to make it? Ok then. Then once he realized he was going to be heading to jail for life for what he did, he decided to kill himself on Sunday morning. Not of sound mind is only an excuse when you lose it temporarily. Not 3 days straight. I’m sorry.
First off, when this project was initially announced the promotional material stated all of Michaels’ 17 matches would be included. Therefore, the Benoit match should be included.
Second, Benoit is NOT a triple murderer. You cannot murder yourself, even if you nonsensical “logic” might appear to imply otherwise.
Third, your momentary snap analogy is inconsequential considering Benoit’s overall brain damage. With that condition you can go in an out of normalcy.
Fourth, if you don’t buy the medical science proving you can go in and out of normalcy when you are in Benoit-like condition, what if he wasn’t of sound mind and snapped when he killed the first two people? We’ve already established that he wasn’t. The texts and the fact that he killed himself doesn’t even come into play here as frequently idiots who commit suicide (which is what it’s called when you kill yourself, not murder) are considered misunderstood heroes.
I pick you to be my lawyer! Take all these people to school!
I personally believe the Benoit match SHOULD be included in the set, but such is the way of the world on this site these that I feel like I will just get flamed by these moral do-gooders if I dare to list my reasons why. It’s a shame. God forbid anybody presents the other side of the argument.
This is no different then a greatest hits release , like Kiss or Aerosmith would release. It’s good to have something out there for newer fans who only know DX or HBK as the guy who was a ref a few times. What made him the icon? What made him Mr. Wrestlemania? This is good for people who aren’t going to buy 16 different releases to get these matches … Lets be honest , some of these show stunk except for the HBK match!
You are right! HBK vs. Tito Santana was a match for the ages!
Personally i find this Benoit thing a bit dragged out even to this day, No one really knows what happend on that day they were not there so they did not see if from there own eyes, it was all media and you should never listen to what media says cause its all bullshit, WWE werent there when it happend with whatever Benoit did, so they are just taking Media side, Who knows but we will never truly know what happend to Benoit and what he did on that day in 07, It is up to WWE to include his matches or not because at the end of the day they can do whatever they want but it is ridiculous to not include complete matches on sets like this even involving Benoit, Whats the worse they could have happened, if they couldnt bother editing the commentary with any praise to Benoit they could have just not included no commentary and just see it from the arena point of view or they could have edited out Benoit entrance and left at it as it is, Well at least people who have been collecting dvd of the years can watch shows with benoit complete and unedited and it is going to stay like that forever cause wwe dont want to include any matches of his unless they really really need to!!
I hate the “no one was there , so no one knows” defense … gimmie a break we like wrestling but these are just people. Why should they get a pass for everything they say or do? If my car has your paint on it and you car is dented and you walk outside and see this and call a cop , when I walk out of Wal-mart can I say , “no one was out here , so know one knows.” ? Would you shake my hand and I would be free to go or would the outstanding evidence make you want to file a report and get my insurance number?
Bret Hart unreleased did not sell well? How did you all find out that it did not sell well? I am surprised….
It was mentioned in WWE’s Q3 conference call.
How well did the Alex Wright unreleased collection sell?
This is a pass. Seems like wwe is trying to milk more money out of fans.. this is a lame release. Hbk unreleased would make 30 times more sense.. and I’m not a mark or nothing and I understand its his performances that got him the name Mr. Wrestlemania, but Shawn has a terrible wm record he lost so much.
your heading is incorrect. wwe clarifies ”exclusion” of chris benoit match, ‘not’ inclusion. wwe is full of a bunch of ball-less corporate douchebags!!!
You may be right about the title. My thinking with that wording was that their synopsis for the DVD inferred the WM20 match is included (“all 17 matches”), therefore Benoit included, but that we now have clarity on the inclusion, or lack thereof as it turns out. I attempted to word it like an update to our last article on it. Also, not give it away unless you read the article. 🙂
Too bad Bret unreleased wasn’t a great seller … In my top 5 releases, I really enjoyed his insight and the matches.
I agree. For me, personally, it was the release of the year. i enjoyed it. More so than his 2005 release.
welli think in this case it isn’t the worst thing ever. shawn was more in the background of that match. the last few mins is all benoit and triple h
This really should have been an unreleased collector’s edition… Total shame!
Exactly! But, no doubt, the very poorly selling Hart unreleased compilation has put the unreleased sets at least temporarily on the shelf. But they should have expected that when you consider they didn’t even have enough master quality material that they had to go ripping stuff off of YouTube (like the Andre match) and off multi-generational VHS (like the Georgia match). Considering that Hart and Michaels had similar careers prior to Michaels’ most recent run (2002-2009) no doubt made the company fearful of releasing an unreleased set on Michaels.
They have to be smart with their next UNRELEASED set and release it on guys who were at the forefront when wrestling was extremely popular in the 80s or 90s and where they can pull entertaining and competitive matches from free TV shows. Guys like Flair and Austin should be the next to get the UNRELEASED compilation set.
I think Austin and Flair have had enough dvds out within the last 4-5 years.
Please no more Austin (I am a fan). His last release was another example of WWE milking the (dry) cow.
You mean the only austin dvd that actually gave a full bio and had 4 discs? yea, milking….
I. Love. Benoit. Great wrestler, awesome role model. Shame that there aren’t more upstanding human beings like him, not just in wrestling, but on the planet.
I wasn’t going to buy this anyway, but you have to look at this, what if more wrestlers started killing their families and killing themselves, that’s really going to butcher the footage that they own. Hopfully that never happens. WWE needs to release better DVD’s like the ones mentioned in the surveys.
Very good point.
Because we’re all wrestling fans, we have our biases. Some of us want to look smart, so to do so they side with the company because God only knows they can’t make a mistake. Others lack the maturity and life experiences (like a death of someone actually important in our lives) and took the Benoit murders a little too personally. Some never cared for Benoit. Others, like myself, hate that shows and storylines get ruined by his deletion.
With all of that said, here’s a story off a non-wrestling website where the writer clearly doesn’t fit into any of the categories stated above. He gives his insights into how removing Benoit affects WWE and how other companies might view it:
http://socialtimes.com/a-storytelling-lesson-from-world-wrestling-entertainments-darkest-chapter_b130930
It’s a good read and I think a lot of people might be surprised to see how those who don’t live within the “WWE Universe” view the company’s current stance on Benoit.
As if this set wasn’t useless enough. But sheep will buy it. Luckily it has the Wrestlemania X Ladder match on it though.
A bonus match will include Mankind/Taker from KOTR with special unreleased commentary by Bob “Spark Plugg” Holly.
Did you unironically call people who don’t buy every DVD WWE releases, “sheep”? Damn those younger fans who weren’t around for Shawn’s heyday! What a buncha marks for buying a DVD that’s readily available in Walmart instead of tediously tracking everything down online! I love this site, but I wish you guys would hear yourselves sometimes.
Yeah, because buying an expensive new release is so much smarter in light of the fact that most of the older releases that are easy to track down on Amazon are cheap. Amazon is so much more tedious than Walmart.
SRB,
You know that unreleased stale commentary you speak of really makes it a must buy regardless of the fact that it’s already been released 28 times.
Yeah like you’re not going to buy this. Let us know when your pre-ordered copy arrives
I’ll be sure to do that douche bag. It will probably arrive around the same time you get the balls to find me and call me an idiot to my face. Ask your moms permission though first you tool.
I have no interest in watching anything Benoit to the point of I destroyed and threw out the hard knocks DVD i owned so it was one less copy in existence!!! for what he did his legacy deserves to be discarded and never glorified.
I believe that there’s a difference between showing a match where he wins (such as WrestleMania XX vs. Triple H & Shawn Michaels for the World Heavyweight Championship) & where he loses (i.e. Fall Brawl 1996: War Games Match between nWo & 4 Horsemen; WrestleMania 21: Money In The Bank Ladder Match vs. Edge, Christian, Chris Jericho, Kane, Shelton Benjamin; New Year’s Revolution 2005: Elimiantion Chamber Match for the World Heavyweight Championship with HBK as the Special Guest Referee vs. HHH, Edge, Jericho, Batista, Randy Orton). Besides, it’s on 3 DVDs [WrestleMania XX, Hard Knocks: The Chris Benoit Story & The Greatest Superstars Of WrestleMania]
It’s wrestling. Who cares who wins? Some of the all-time greats have very average win-loss records.
The fact is that WWE chose to put together this compilation of retreads. They should have stuck to the theme they chose to present. They apparently didn’t. Any way you look at it, this is a massive FAIL.
This set is gonna be a pass with or without the wm 20 match. Consider i own the wm antholigy and i own wm 3 and wm 17-29 on regular dvd.
I was never going to buy this set anyway as I have no need for it as earlier HBK WM matches kinda sucked! 9 & 11 especially & I have actually gotten sick of the Ladder Match from 10!
Obviously WWE are still trying to distance themselves from Benoit as let’s face it, he killed his Wife & Child & instead of facing the charges & the music he killed himself! He did an aweful thing & we seriously need to move on from this!
I do not want to get into a debate saying whether or not the WWE should banish Benoit from all releases or not. My gripe is the WWE shouldn’t put out a Mr. WrestleMania DVD/Blu Ray set if all of the matches aren’t included. I understand that they want to make money but I feel that there are many original sets which have potential to make money: sets on Ted DiBiase, Rick Rude, Daniel Bryan, Junk Yard Dog, Jimmy Hart or Evolution or just be creative like rereleasing all of the Best of the WWF volumes on Blu Ray or more Greatest Rivalries sets with The Rock and Steve Austin or Edge and John Cena or Mick Foley and Undertaker. Don’t get me wrong, Shawn Michaels is a phenomenal athlete. I just don’t feel this set should be titled this way if it isn’t a complete set. By the way…I think this site is fantastic and check it everyday to check up on my DVD news. Keep up the great work!!!
NOT BUYING!
I know there’s some people that say “I can still watch Benoit matches and separate Benoit the wrestler and Benoit the person.” Two things I have to say about that. Number 1, you people are stronger than me. Number 2, there is no separating “the wrestler” and “the person”. Ignorance of the truth does not make it better.
I actually watched the Mania 20 match not too long ago for the first time since the Benoit murders happened. The whole time I was watching the match all I could think about was “As soon as this match ends, Benoit’s wife and little son will be in that same ring celebrating with him. The same wife and son that he strangled and murdered.”
It has nothing to do with “ignorance of the truth.” It has to do with being mature enough to realize that it doesn’t matter. He was an athletic entertainer. Nothing more. Nothing less. Just like his race, creed and orientation doesn’t matter, neither does any other decision he made in his private life. He was a part of history and while he should never be celebrated, he shouldn’t be getting removed from comprehensive projects or complete show presentations.
@anonymous, get yourself a legit username and stop hiding behind “anonymous”. Then we can talk.
Wow. You’re a conflicted individual. Me, I don’t take professional wrestling that seriously.
I’m not conflicted at all. If you read what I wrote you’ll see that I’m very clear in how I feel about the situation.
the fact you couldn’t give an logical explanation to the anonymous’ response shows what an ignorant prick you are.
I’m more than happy to give a response to him(her?, it?). I just refuse to waste my time arguing with someone without an actual username.
Or maybe you just don’t have a good argument so you hide behind this “get a username” nonsense.
Yes. It’s nonsense. Trying to have a conversation with someone who doesn’t give themselves a name is nonsense. Anyone on the site can use “anonymous”. How do I know that if I respond to them that it will be the same person responding back to me? There could be 20 people using “anonymous” on this site for all we know. If I’m going to get into a conversation with someone I’d like to know that I’m talking to the same person. What really is nonsense is people who not only hide behind a computer, but also are afraid to even give themselves a label to which other people can identify them.
If whoever responded to my initial comment was really interested in hearing my response then they would have no problem giving themselves a name. It’s not hard. It takes 2 seconds to type it out. And since they haven’t done that they clearly don’t care about anyone else’s opinions except their own. It’s essentially just another form of trolling.
And I’ve said way more than I have to about this subject. I’m done.
Good for WWE. I take no enjoyment or entertainment whatsoever in watching Benoit in past matches. I wish people would stop bringing him up.
However, I still think this DVD would have been better if it has been Shawn Michaels’ Unreleased Collector’s Series!
For the best I guess. It would anger fans and those who think its wrong to promote a murder if they brought it out in butchered form.
I understand that the Benoit tragedy was possibly the lowest point in WWE or Pro-Wrestling history, but if Benoit is not a focal point of the advertising or release in general (which he won’t be, since it’s a specific compilation highlighting HBK) there’s no reason to edit or cut his matches. Releasing “The Streak” while the Undertaker is still competing is ridiculous; putting out Shawn’s ‘complete’ WrestleMania DVD without one of the matches is even dumber. If there is a legal reason to cut Benoit content from DVD’s, fine, but it was years ago, and he’s been on other releases, so I’d prefer WWE stop flop-flopping. He was one of three wrestlers, competing in one out of seventeen matches. I can’t imagine a huge revolt taking place for Benoit’s tiny cameo on the set. No sale for me.
Very well stated and I agree 100% with your thoughts.
This release was already a waste as it featured all previously released material. Removing Benoit essentially ruins the whole concept. It’s no longer a comprehensive look at Michaels’ WrestleMania career.
Benoit put a black eye on WWE and the whole pro wrestling industry, flushing his career down the toilet just by his actions those last three days of his life…why should WWE include any of his matches when they don’t have to?
The Triple Threat was basically focused on Benoit’s journey and it probably would have been difficult to edit out Benoit references…so instead of butchering the whole match, might as well not include it. If people really want it just buy WM20 on Amazon, its like $7 brand new.
Good thing the match won’t make it. The commentary blanks and dubbing the crowd reactions (the NY crowd was 100% behind Benoit and chanting his name throughout the match) will be a heavy duty and take away too much from the match IMO.
Screw them for false advertising. I wouldn’t have bought it anyway because I’d just get the WM XX DVD where the triple threat is unedited but still, the false advertising is what annoys me about this.
What’s false about it? They rectified the typo months before it came out… they’re not trying to fool anyone
Good call by WWE.
This DVD is rather redundant to be honest, but including the Benoit match would only divert attention from the focus of the set and possibly lead to negative publicity.
Some will point at the MITB anthology and cry hypocrisy but the WM 20 match focused so heavily on Benoit and obviously it was his career highlight, so much different example. The best decision is to omit it totally.
Bang on. The set’s about HBK. I’d actually would rather the set be about HBK’s best WM performances (so a few other matches could get scrapped) but considering Shawn was a late addition to the match so to speak, this is the first match that could be scrapped for that reason, let alone the most obvious reason. I have no problem with this at all, and look forward to the set, especially with Shawn’s additional commentary.
Nowhere does this set say Anthology. So I don’t get your point. Its Mr Wrestlemania
I can respect the choice to include Benoit on future releases or not include him. I think that with the sensitivity of the whole benoit murder controversy, it’s probably a safer choice to leave him out. What I don’t like is they include him (MIB anthology), then they don’t (Mr. Wrestlemania). And when they do include him, it’s with an editing job that does absolutely nothing for anything or anyone. Either way WWE goes, I say just be consistent about it. The only message the Benoit DVD situation sends out is that their is no message (not a legitimate one, anyway). The headache continues…
Where exactly does it say “anthology”? It says “Mr. Wrestlemania”. Not “The Shawn Michaels Wrestlemania Anthology”. Reading comprehension, my friend. I’m sure the fact that its NOT called an anthology was a very deliberate decision. You just wrote yourself… “What I don’t like is they include him (MIB anthology), then they don’t (Mr. Wrestlemania).” One is called anthology, one is not. There’s your answer.
No buy.
Ditto. Not because I have any issue with the decision on Benoit – but because the entire purpose of the set is that it’s a complete anthology. And it isn’t.
This set is really just a milking of a cow that has gone dry. We have all seen these matches. Pack us a fresh anthology: “Mr. Lose My Smile, rather than the title”-that’s one’s at least 6.5 hours.
Where does it say anywhere that its a complete set? It’s called Mr WrestleMania. Not Shawns Mania Anthology
I’m sure people will hate this, but here is why I think it’s smart on WWE’s part. If you were going to buy this DVD before, you’re probably still going to buy it. Nobody is buying this DVD or any other DVD just for a Benoit match. If you want that match so badly, you’ll spend $6 on Amazon for it. But, there is still a large majority (not the vocal minority online) that want nothing to do with watching a Benoit match. In fact, people may not buy the DVD because it’s there. It’s playing it safe.
The days of thinking that the Internet wrestling fans comprise a small minority are long gone. Everybody has Internet access. Every has Google, YouTube, etc. Everybody can find this or any site. Everybody can use their own brain to come to their own conclusions. We no longer accept everything this or any company says as true or necessarily the correct choice. Those who do are the new age crop of WWE fans who have such loyalty that you’d think the company were a religion. These people are in the ever-shrinking minority.
I’m one who is totally for not including this guy on DVD releases, but I’m kind of mixed on this one.
While I would totally understand them including the Mania XX match, I wonder if maybe they chose to leave this one out because it would require an amount of editing that would take away from the match as a whole.
I’m just trying to find a rational reason why they would include the guy on Anthologies and complete history sets, but leave him out of this one.
I’m not going to debate not including the triple threat, I get why they do it. Maybe when they did the interview Shawn he let it be known he didn’t want the match on there, who knows?
What’s odd is that the description says all 17 but it will really only be 16. Makes me think somebody in the DVD department forgot the rule.
Or maybe they wrote the synopsis, but then someone made the call to leave it out after the fact?